porshh951

Ask a body builder..... Guys unite

28 posts in this topic

This post is for the guys. I know every one of us wants to retain muscle mass and look as good as possible post op. This requires strict nutrition and great training. I'd like to start a thread centered around nothing, but guys wanting to know post op nutition and workout info to try and improve their physique. I would of loved to of had a tool like this when I was first losing my weight and curious about long term training. Training is near and dear to my heart and something I've been actively doing daily for 7 years now. I do not know everything and I'm not a personal trainer. I'm just a guy who's been there and back again with life experience and I'd love to offer real advice and help to anyone who is intereted.

 

This thread is not restricted to me. If someone posts a question and you know the honest answer please post up your experience and help. I'd like to help create a place where guys get hard feedback without knit gloves on.

 

A couple of quick pictures and background on myself. I was 445lbs, my lowest recorded weight was 187lbs. I've run, biked, and lifted my way here. I've had to work around serious injuries that now keep me from running or biking long distances. I've had two skin surgeries and I was looking at a third when a buddy of mine suggested I stop cutting and start lifting. It was here in my journey I got serious about iron and started to develop a regular program centered around muscle gain. I hope to give honest feedback and help out there to my brothers, I hope to be of some help to guys who like me, see all the lose skin and hate it!

 

I will check this thread regularly. Don't be affraid to go out and try something new. You never know you may like how you feel/look.

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Edited by porshh951
excruzer and JayMT like this

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Your upper arms / shoulder look strange, must be the mirror picture. :)

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Your upper arms / shoulder look strange, must be the mirror picture. :)

Thanks been lots of work.

Protein myth #1. I need to eat one gram of protein per pound of body weight. No I almost never eat that much protein in a day.

Edited by porshh951

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A great chest and tri-cep routine.

 

Decline dumbbell bench- 3 sets 75% of max reps usually 8-12~http://videos.bodybuilding.com/watch/32131/decline-dumbbell-bench-press

Dumbell incline bench-3 sets 75% of max reps usually 8-12~http://videos.bodybuilding.com/watch/32421/incline-dumbbell-press

Dumbell pull over-3 sets 75% of max reps usually 8-12~http://videos.bodybuilding.com/watch/54771/bent-arm-dumbbell-pullover

Dips- 3 sets till failure~http://videos.bodybuilding.com/watch/54741/bench-dips

Plank- 3 sets hold till failure 1 set consists of 3 holds

Cable tri-cep pull down-3 sets 75% of max reps usually 8-12~http://videos.bodybuilding.com/watch/32891/triceps-pushdown-rope-attachment

Machine chest flys-3 sets 75% of max reps usually 8-12~http://www.bodybuilding.com/exercises/detail/view/name/butterfly

 

On dips you can start off using the bench or just a chair and do dips off of that. That's how I got started. Eventually I graduated to doing them on a dip bar and now sometimes I alternate between dip bar(It's just a simple machine that has to handles sticking out with a back pad you lean against as you support your weight on your tri-ceps) and the seated dip machine(if your gym has one).

 

People think you have to lift crazy heavy weight in order to develop muscle tissue. This isn't the case. What builds muscle tissue is regulated sleep patterns matched with proper protein intake and TUT. Time under tension is what builds new muscle tissue and stretches and pulls everything out. You don't need heavy weight to build time under tension. You need proper form and slow and controlled reps with contraction of the desired group. So squeeze and hold the desired muscle throughout the range of motion and you'll find you can get an incredable workout with using small weights. I myself frequently still workout with 20-25lb dumbells even though I can lift far heavier.

 

Here is what dip machine looks like if your gym has one- http://videos.bodybuilding.com/watch/32191/dip-machine

Here is standard dip machine- http://videos.bodybuilding.com/watch/54831/dips-triceps-version.

 

I also frequently use smith machines and chest press machine as my strength weakens and I still don't feel like I have adequately worked the muscle, but don't have the strength to maintain proper form. You can always go lighter. Remember it's not about the number on the machine, or the dumbell it's how you controll the weight properly and contract the muscle group.

 

I'll be uploading some of my back, leg, bi-cep, and shoulder exercise routines too. These are just helpful starting points. Hopefully this information will be a helpful guide to someone looking to get into the gym and lift weights. I know when I started I barely new anything and it was trial by fire. One of the biggest lessons I had to learn is ego lifting doesn't help anyone. If your having to swing your body or activate other muscle groups to help assist in moving the weight you will not make gains and you will likely end up injured. Better to focus on proper form and a lighter weight. Trust me your strength will increase and you will love how you look if you lift consistantly.

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Here is a recent email I sent that has a lot of what I do in it, I figured it would be beneficial to post this here.

 

Hey brother, finally getting around to re sending this. Hopefully it finds you in good health.

            The biggest ms-conception that people make about lifting weights is that they have to go as heavy as possible in order to build muscle. First thing you need to know about building new muscle is it takes 3 key ingredients. You can still build muscle mass without all three of these but, lose any two and it becomes nearly impossible, sleep, protein, time under tension. Now here's where it gets sketchy. There are lots of different ways to develop time under tension, for some it's going to failure using heavy weight and stretching and clawing to get that bar up that one LAST rep. It's in that last rep their actually building muscle, not in the reps leading up to it. However, in my experience two things happen when people start to lift heavy. Their form goes to complete *&^% and they begin to activate other muscle groups in order to help push/pull the weight; they also put themselves at great risk for injury.

             I find that most people lift this way due to poor knowledge and ego. After all it's just not badass to go to the gym and never lift more than a 20lb dumbbell, however I assure you it's in this awareness that true builders make great gains. I use lighter weights making sure I have total control throughout the movement and range. I do this by going with usually 75% of my max and increasing the amount of reps I do. I still get to those reps like the other guy lifting heavy as hell, the difference is because I'm getting their with lighter weight I can control it better and if I have something go wrong I'm putting myself at less risk for injury. Now this needs to be said hyptrophy(the type of training I'm discussing with you) will help you gain new fibers, it does not however increase strength very much. That's why it's important to build what most call a hybrid program. A program in which some days you do high volume low weight and others during the week where you go heavy and do less reps/sets. This will maintain and building new strength while developing new muscle tissue.

             Just about anyone can show you a workout training program and throw some sups your way. Unfortunately if you don't have the right approach it's going to make little difference. With the right approach lots of different types of training will all have positive effects. What I'm getting at here is there is no ONE way to train. You need to explore your own body and it's limitations to discover what types of training best suit your goals. For me personally I could care less about strength. Some guys out there want to bench 405lbs and bang it off their chest like He-man. I could give a @~$& about any of that, I have zero interest in competting with anyone professional or for fun. I used to be morbidly obese. I recently started lifting iron again to change the shape of my body and fill in lose skin as much as possible. So for me I do very little strength training exercises and my program is more built about high volume with time under tension. As far as sups go I really only take a pre-workout some of the time I've already given you the name it's called jacked(not the new version called jacked 3D). I take hyper protein which is like a more refined version of iso. It's faster acting protein with almost no fat or extra's. You can buy hyperbolic protein at your local GNC as well as my pre workout Jacked.

                  I change up my split constantly and I also switch up with exercises I incorporate weekly. I'll give you a basic run down though of what each split looks like so that you can build your own program from there.

Sunday/Thursday (Chest/tris)

Decline Dumbbell bench
Dumbell incline bench
Dumbell pull over Dumbell bench press
Bench Dip
Cable tri-cep pushdown
Machine Chest flys
Upright rows
Seated dip machine
Chest press
Decline barbell bench press
Flat bench Dumbell bench

Tuesday/Friday (Shoulders/Core)

Planks
Reverse crunch
Rollar(You know the basic thing you've seen on TV where you hold and move back and forth on the ground supported by this basic roller with rubber grips)
Dumbbell shoulder press
Dumbbell front raise
Dumbbell lateral raise
Barbell shrug
Shrug machine
Front plate raise
Machine shoulder press
Rear lateral raises
Shrugs
Seated dumbbell shoulder press
Reverse chest flys(works rear dealt)

Wednesday/Saturday (Back/Bi's)
lat pulldown
Assisted pull up machine
Raw pull ups(wide grip and close grip)
Cable seated high row
Cable seated low row
Machine lateral pull down
Dead lift
Hammer Curl
Seated Preacher Curl
Standing bi-cep curl
Concentration dumbbell curl
One arm row

 Monday (Legs-usually work these throughout the week in addition to other muscle groups)
Walking dumbbell lunge
Seated Calf raise
Bar squat
Calf raise(done on leg press)
Machine leg curl
Machine leg press
Leg extension

All of these exercises are done after proper warmup in sauna and light lifting. I will usually do two warm up sets on the first couple of exercise to make sure I've got good blood flow. All are usually 3-5 sets per exercise with rep range anywhere from 10-15 reps per set and usually at around 75% of my max. Sometimes I'll go heavier it just depends. Remember that when you are doing each movement to slow it down, control it and squeeze the muscle properly. Getting expansion and contraction of the muscle fibers and opening them up is what allows them to be torn/grow. Do NOT bring your ego with you to the gym, it will only hurt your progress and potentially your body. I hope this email is helpful. If you'd like a great website to give video/photo feedback of every exercise shown here and many more check out. http://www.bodybuilding.com/exercises/  ; Click on the desired muscle group and it will populate a list of exercises that all have video instruction.

VonnyLeeuw likes this

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Wanted to Share my wife's Turkey burger recipe. It's got all the protein you need and no fat. Much better option than even lean beef.

 

My goal was to have as few ingredients as possible; low fat,high protein burgers that are juicy, not dry, with a minimum of prep time.  If you have tons of time, you could mince garlic and onions and saute them, being sure to cool them before adding them to the turkey.

Disclaimer:  I've never tasted these burgers due to the high volume of Jalapeno.  If you think they need more of this or less of that, knock yourself out.

Ingredients:

3 pounds ground turkey
1/2 cup soy sauce
2-4 teaspoons onion powder
2-4 teaspoons garlic powder
1-2 teaspoons ground pepper
2-6 Jalapenos

1.  Place turkey in a good size bowl and pour soy sauce all over it.  You can mix it a bit with a spoon to get it well distributed and set aside.  (this will marnate for a bit)
2.  Dice Jalapenos in a food processor.  
3.  Add spices and Jalapenos to the turkey and mix thoroughly.  Using your hands is effective, but I keep the warm water running for when mine go numb from the cold.  Wash your hands several times afterwards too - bacteria can be a problem but Jalapeno in the eye (or worse) is miserable.
4.  If you want to be really exact, scoop out about 1/2 cup of meat mix and weigh it. Should be 4 oz.  Some of that is Jalapeno, but not much.  Add or subtract meat as needed.
5.  Place the 4 oz of meat mix into the "form" on a flat cutting board. 
    because it is so soft, you can not really form burgers with your hands.
     4 ounces perfectly fits in my forms but you'll have to try yours to see.
6.  Heat as little oil as possible (maybe 1 tablespoon - depends upon the size of the pan) in your pan     until it is shimmering.  (hot!)  DONT use pam - it will burn and taste funny.
7.   You MUST use a flat, preferably metal, flexible spatula and it takes a time or two to pick up the burgers without destroying the shape.
Slide the spatula with some care, some speed and some skill under the burger and place the burger into your pan.  Aim carefully - you can't move them once they sizzle.
8.  DO NOT TOUCH those burgers for 4-5 minutes.  If you're trying to move it and its falling apart, its telling you it isn't ready.  By the time you turn it, it should move easily. 
I cook them on high for the first side, flip, cook on high for a minute or two, then turn the burner to medium. If you're not sure they're done, use a meat thermometer.  I just make sure they're over 140 degrees.  If you cook them to 165, they will be quite dry.

tip - don't push on the burger with the spatula.  When the juices run put, that's your flavor leaving.

Let burgers rest for a few minutes to complete cooking and retain juices.

Enjoy!

Edited by porshh951

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These pre and post plastics photos are already in a members section from years ago but I wanted to share them here in the men's section. To all the guys out there that might want to do the same thing I did. I'm here to help in whatever compacity I can.

The last picture is me today(I've been cutting for a month). Currently 214lbs. Looking to eat maintaince calories and do maintaince workouts through summer, then I'm going to start bulking again in August.

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VonnyLeeuw and ✯AprilWine✯ like this

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I know they say you can't target a certain spot. But do you have any exercises to lose back fat/love handles?

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You cannot target a certain spot as far as the fat layer there. Your body will lose fat in a certain order, and you can't do anything about it. But the exercise will cause you to lose it, so eventually the part you dislike will go away too.

 

And with resistance training, since you build muscle if you do it right, you get the added benefit (when compared to pure cardio) that the muscles chew up calories and carbs after you are done exercising for repair and to grow to meet the demands you are placing on them better. I could digress for at least a thousand words on this subject. LOL.

 

In fact, if you build enough new muscle, they will eat calories and fat while you sleep for you, as long as you continue using them in resistance movements and have protein in your bloodstream while you sleep.

Edited by JRH

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Thanks for the tips. I have been working on my upper body a little more aggressively than in the past, but not like you. I am pleased to fill in that loose skin with lean muscle!

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Thanks for the tips. I have been working on my upper body a little more aggressively than in the past, but not like you. I am pleased to fill in that loose skin with lean muscle!

This was my exact goal as well. It is achievable. No you can't target fat areas in the same manner you can muscle bellies with iso movements. There's really nothing about how you lose fat you can do to highlight or target certain lagging area's, it's all genetics. I will say however you can target and grow muscle bellies in those area's and that will have a lasting impact on how you wear the fat you have as you lose it and your overall physique.

 

I would do alot of back work. Even upper back work like rows and pull downs will help you pull up lose skin, that's what happened to me. As far as lower back excercise start out with lower back raises, and as you get stronger hold a weighted plate to you chest as you do them. Here's what lower back raises look like.

 

http://www.bodybuilding.com/exercises/detail/view/name/hyperextensions-back-extensions

 

 

Deadlifts are also great for lower back. I would recomend starting with no weights and just the bar as you work on your form and get used to the idea of training around weights.

Edited by porshh951

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Thanks for the replies guys. I'm gonna try back work outs and see how it goes.

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This is an interesting post. I am 6"5 and have/always had a lot of natural muscle mass. During my screenings they said that I have about 225 lbs in lean muscle mass. I am worried that after surgery that I will lose a lot of that. I want to maximize my honeymoon period and lose as much weight/fat as possible but at the same time I also would like to keep as much muscle as possible. What do you recommend as far as working to minimize muscle loss?

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Sorry I've been away traveling. Great question and I have the exact same concerns. You need a higher protein diet that's still calorie appropriate for your goals. As far as training we have a real advantage here starting overweight. We've developed fat muscle that yes typically everyone loses when they go to a strict and sudden calorie deficit that most don't have a choice over post WLS. You need to do a lot of core body movements with tons and tons of volume. Do pushups like crazy, pull ups(assisted to start), workout with lighter weights with increased volume especially when your still heavy. Your body alone carrying around all that extra fat mass will have to work very hard to do these movements naturally. As you lose weight you need to increase the weights, but keep the rep ranges and movements high in volume.

 

I used to do all sorts of weighted lunges, running up and down stairs over and over again, pull ups, pushups, burpies, etc. The most important factors in muscle retention and growth still comes down to the cornerstone 3, you need protein, proper rest, and steady training. Constantly push youself in every movement trying to go beyond what you think you can do by one rep or two. When you do this multiple times a week you will see your muscle loses kept minimal. Go get a proper body scan if atall possible to learn what  your true LBM is and then keep track of it. I got tested every several months to keep track and make sure I wasn't losing muscle mass. I still lost some of my fat muscle, but was able to retain most of it and that's all we can ask for.

 

From there at goal weight you start training like any other person trying to build muscle mass. You will be surprised at what you can accomplish with consistant training.

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 I have a 3 month membership for the fitness room at the local family center. I started it last week on October 1st. It is convenient for me and it was affordable. I am primarily concerned about building upper body strength and core strength a little later. My core and arms atrophied really badly when I had the rapid weight gain and stopped being active. My legs have always had to support my body and I was a rabid mountain biker so I still have a good amount of muscle tone in my legs.

I am only 7 weeks post op and my doc doesn’t want me to do too much core work just yet. They would like 3 months for the stomach to completely heal.

 

 

I worked my upper body 4 days in a row and by the 4th day I was feeling like I did too much. I know you are supposed to wait 48 hours but with my knee injury and restrictions on core work upper body was my only option.  I recently got “weight training for dummies” and found out I was using too little weight, although for someone starting from scratch that is not so bad. I was doing very light weight and doing 5 sets of ten reps on every position for upper body.

 

 

While the book suggests different sets for different goals. What it did say was that I should use a weight sufficient so that at the last rep of the set it is very difficult to complete. While still not very much weight, I had to double what I was doing for most of the positions. it forced me to rest longer between sets, and I didn’t do 5 sets of everything.

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WOW is all I can say that is one incredible transformation. I cant imagine all the changes in your life after all that weight loss. All for the best I hope. Gratz

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great tips here. I lost a lot of muscle mass after surgery and started lifting again. I hope not to need a tummy tuck and will try to fill it in.

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Im looking to start really lifting weights and getting some size. Bringing this thread back to life. I'd like to start meal prepping for the week. Did you just use meat proteins and vegetables. Or did you use any other kinds of foods? 

Edited by Kyle314
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Those video are great- thanks

 

I assume that to determine the percentage of max- is that one Press with the dumbells for example or is it how much you can do a in a rep of 10?

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The women need a thread like this ... I think I'm the only one here who lifts heavy though :/

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The women need a thread like this ... I think I'm the only one here who lifts heavy though :/

 

nope! i do too! i believe sarah (snsforever916) does as well.

 

try starting one in the women's forum. we can exchange ideas and programs!

Sleevarilla and GettinKinny like this

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nope! i do too! i believe sarah (snsforever916) does as well.

 

try starting one in the women's forum. we can exchange ideas and programs!

I need to lift heavy! I tend to stay around the 10-15 pounds mark. I do lift weights and eventually would like to build up to larger #'s because it does completely shape your body. I am kinda in a cardio round for a minute. I am thinking this summer when I get closer to goal weight that I may hire a personal trainer for a month or two to help shape my body using heavy weight training!

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Heavy lifting rocks! I do a version of Strong Lifts 5x5 ... although I haven't gotten back into it yet since surgery. I was told no core work for 12 weeks, and just about every lift works the core. Now, my broken toes have me sidelined for a few more weeks. After that ... watch out! Let's just take over the men's thread :)

Edited by Sleevarilla
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I'm leg pressing over 600 lbs now, bench pressing 225, dead lift 215.

These are "metric" lifts. Get a baseline of each of these exercises and work to improve them, by doing high reps of 60-85% of your max.

Alternate days of arms, shoulders/back and legs.

It will completely reshape your body.

I also do 1:30 planks with 140 lbs of weight on my back for core work.

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I'm leg pressing over 600 lbs now, bench pressing 225, dead lift 215.

These are "metric" lifts. Get a baseline of each of these exercises and work to improve them, by doing high reps of 60-85% of your max.

Alternate days of arms, shoulders/back and legs.

It will completely reshape your body.

I also do 1:30 planks with 140 lbs of weight on my back for core work.

Seriously this is my goal to start heavy lifting. Not those numbers...I may die! I need a personal trainer.

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