Voyage into your conscience - Page 4 - ThinnerTimes

Vim&Vigour · 03-23-2008, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fisher1000

Claire!

I think about this all the time. You posted something months ago about your "authentic self." I don't think you know what kind of impact that post had on me. I ask myself all the time if what I am doing is "authentic" to me or if I am acting in a reactionary or coerced way. I think I need a little bracelet that says: WWCD? (What Would Claire Do?) or AIBA2M (Am I Being Authentic To Myself?)

We've been something else for so long...becoming who we truly are is very difficult. But it's necessary, and we deserve to be who we REALLY are.

-Mike

Those bracelets Mike are priceless!
I could do with one of each on each arm!
Claire - you ALWAYS have the right word and are brilliant at summing up! (unlike my wordiness!)
Vim

Vim&Vigour · 03-23-2008, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coptergirl

This really struck a cord in me. On the surface, I was the happy-go-lucky one and inside I was fearful of so much. Maybe I still am of certain things, my marriage and its history specifically. Truth in looking at oneself if very difficult and oftentimes painful...and very very scary because of the inevitable changes that must occur when doing this inward examination. Sometimes denial is easier...and sometimes denial ain't just a river in Egypt anymore.

Oh Whitney, you sound as though you have tussled with this for a while and found a solution through joy and happiness - and a good understanding of denial! Interesting to think of the choices we make in life!

Ultimately, there is a distinct difference between joy and happiness. Happiness comes from circumstances surrounding you (I am happiest on top of my horse), but true joy comes from within and knowing and loving yourself. Am I joyful every day? No. But I am joyful many days, and for that I am grateful.

Very few posters really speak about joy and happiness - you seem to live it! Thank G-d for horses!

HAPPY Easter and best wishes!
Vim

fisher1000 · 03-23-2008, 12:01 PM

I just love you, Vim!

If we had been young together, we would have been great friends, I know it! I'm glad we're getting to know each other now. The words we choose are so important, and I love that we share our words with each other...

Happy Easter!

-Mike

Claire-in-Texas · 03-23-2008, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vim&Vigour

Those bracelets Mike are priceless!
I could do with one of each on each arm!
Claire - you ALWAYS have the right word and are brilliant at summing up! (unlike my wordiness!)
Vim

Vim, both you and Mike give me wayyyy tooo much credit.

I battle daily, sometimes minute to minute, from the scars of my childhood and right up to the day my mother died in 1994 - and since. I was born late in her life, with a 20 year old sister and a 16 year old brother. When my sister was 23 and I was 3, she (my sister) passed away of Leukemia. My mother got it in her mind that I was her punishment. I was sent by G-d as a poor replacement of the young woman He would take. And I grew up under that cloud - never good enough, never pretty enough, never smart enough, never talented enough, NEVER.......

My father was a wonderful man, but died when I was 20 (and was sickly throughout my life), and left me with my mother who tortured me emotionally until the day she died (at the age of 94).

I turned to food at a young age, it was comforting and compelling.

As I said above, it is a constant battle of self talk (negative and positive) to fight the fight for my emotional self, and find the AUTHENTIC ME ( didn't think anyone read that one, Mike, except for you and me). There are times when I think I have found her, when I can touch her, feel her. But then there are times when the AUTHENTIC ME is lost somehow.

There is, of course, a lot to this story, but the above outline gives you a sense of my struggle to surface my AUTHENTIC ME, to get to know her. I am not there yet. Today I am definitely not there.

I am in my third marriage - what does that tell you about the Claire you think you know who always knows the right thing to do....???????

There is a lot of unhappiness within me, scars that will never heal, pain that I feel all the time. I have abandonment issues and am insecure. I never knew what loving a mother was like, and I was relieved when she died. It's painful as I write this, and it's cathartic at the same time.

The joyful Claire is true, though. It's not an act. It's not forced. It's the AUTHENTIC ME that I would be all the time if not for the scars.

What drove me to wls was pain of a different type - excruciating pain in my back (spinal stenosis - degenerative lumbar spine disease). It was either lose weight FAST or be in lala land from pain pills. My quality of life was gone, my marriage was therefore not fulfilling for the most part (nor was it for my husband). Now, one year (almost) post op, and I still am battling my demons, but they are in a different form than food - and even more painful without the food that comforted me for soooo many years.

Everyone has a story to tell.....Vim, thank you for this thread.

Vim&Vigour · 03-23-2008, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fisher1000

I felt a little surge of thought about the emotional side of all we're discussing and manifested this:

An eagle and a sparrow
Create the soul of me
They are different in effect
But they live in the same tree.
The sparrow life is easy
So I perch and just pretend
That I’m part of the same sky
That other birds fly in.
The eagle flies sometimes
But then, only in response
To things beyond the sparrow’s heart
Or anxious renaissance.
I want the eagle all the time
And overcome the sparrow
But my tree is not that sturdy
And the sap is sick and yellow.
If I unleash the eagle,
What will the outcome be?
If I desert the sparrow,
Will I find validity?
So, do I perch much longer—
Do I seek new heights—
Or do I change into a phoenix—
And opt to now ignite?

-Mike

The soar, the birds, perches, igniting, how many symbols in one poem! How wonderfully meaningful!
Yes, the choices we have to make... the layers that we face...
Thank you Mike for such an insightful spontaneous response!
I love "And the sap is sick and yellow.
If I unleash the eagle
What will the outcome be?

Thank you!
Vim

Vim&Vigour · 03-23-2008, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Persephone

I love this thread and I love reading Vim's writing!!! I briefly skimmed the surface (i'm currently at work) and will fully dive in a little later.

Here are some surface thoughts:

When I was seven I was found hiding in a closet eating my aunt's birthday gift of those puffy peppermints that melt in your mouth.

P, interesting that you wanted to be on your own and understandably your knew what you were doing was "wrong", "stealing" your aunt's gift. How you were longing for something nice and to enjoy!

My dad found me and was disgusted that I had devoured them all by myself. "Greed, selfish, blah, blah, blah" - yes but what about feeling cherished and cared for, comforted instead by the sweets? The point is that your step-dad was indeed right in his observation but did not handle the situation you needed! He was a new dad to me. My mom had married him 6 weeks after meeting him and I barely knew him. I remember feeling ashamed and humiliated. I was active at that time. Star soccer player of the Blue Angels (won the sportsmanship award)

When we moved into the family home I became far less active and would spend hours in my room transported by books. Thankfully you had one safe refuge!They became my best friends and I didnt go outside so much anymore. I would sneak food into my room. eat and read. eat and read. Adults would typically be relieved not having to deal with "troublesome" offspring, especially if not their own!

When I was 14, mom enrolled me in weight watchers that summer. I weighed 140 lbs and successfully lost 10 lbs. I looked good at 130! The school year brought changes. I was enrolled in a public school for the first time since 6th grade. Coming from a private school of less then 100 students K-12 it was a shock to the system and I had not yet developed the proper social skills. Going into the lunch room was torture so I would buy bread sticks, scones, etc from the vendor just inside the door and then retreat to the hallway. I gained that 10lbs plus some in no time.
It is amazing how we find ways to avoid obstacles!
To be continued from home. I am now done with work.

Persephone, I would love to hear more. I have at long last read your entire thread on "Girl Disappearing" and love your writing. Your insight rings many bells within me and though we do not share the same music or spiritual aspects, so many landmarks are the same! It feels really reassuring and warming to meet another soul of similiar inclination!
Keep up your magnificent writing - most inspiring and refreshing!
Cheers,
Vim

Vim&Vigour · 03-23-2008, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nyn

However, the move from high school (small pond) to a large university (HUGE pond) was a bit of a shock. I was no longer the star -- which on one hand was a huge relief, but on the other was a very private and depressing let down. I no longer had a team so then I moved more into my own head, and that was the start of me building the walls around myself.
Nyn, this sounds SOOO familiar. Often what lacks to bring to fruition is a sufficient ripening process. It's all very well picking green tomatoes to "ripen" in transit, but they never reach their full potential of flavour and thus satisfaction when picked too early. I recognise this from my own school days...

I started gaining weight in college, but it wasn't until I got into law school and faced several more private and family-related fiascos and challenges that I really packed on the pounds. My schedule was insane (working full time in the day and going to school until 10pm) and I honestly believe that I was undiagnosed depressive for several years.
Easily done by repression of warning signals!

I do often spend time pondering my life and how I got to this place. Even when I was at my largest, my general good health and natural athleticism allowed me to be in denial about how bad it was. I could still move around with relative ease.
Mike has the same query - how on earth did I get to ... pounds?!

It is only through looking at photos that I see the truth. And the truth...well, that is like the shadowy door in a horror movie. Do you really want to open it up and face the axe-wielding monster?

Oh boy, no! As soon as a see a sci-fi film, I avoid it like the plague. Why should I deliberately wish to frighten myself, put myself through "unnecessary" pain and discomfort? I have only just yesterday faced my "photograph demons" and sought out every single digital photo of myself (I usually am the one yielding the camera!) and put them in chronological order to face my yoyo dieting failures! I will not go there again! My horror movie! (You can see my album in my profile). So, you see, your description is reflective: it fits!

Nyn, your reply has helped me create my photo album - so officially thank you! That, coupled with a challenge from OmahaJim got me out!

Please keep posting - I always enjoy reading your lines!
Cheers,
Vim

Vim&Vigour · 03-23-2008, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fisher1000

Nyn,

You can be that star still.Yes, Nyn and Mike. Where there is a will there is a way. We can all shine, some people shine stronger than others, but then the perception of "shine" varies from individual to individual... Even a blind man can see a shine...

How you got to anyplace is less significant than where you're going from here. Absolutely true! I think that's what Vim is getting at--and probably is the reason that we have to learn history. Spot on! You must know the heart and soul of previous actions in order to make new and better decisions from today and onward.But I presume this only applies when we genuinely WISH to improve?

We can't embrace a future that has no roots. We only get through the future because we got through the past. Don't entirely agree: we can for a while, as an infant. I suppose that changes once we understand the concept of roots, i.e. "been there done that" experience. Say a toddler is putting his hand on the radiator which is hot. It might be too hot for him and burn him. It will hurt. He might touch it a couple more times but from practice will learn to avoid the heat. It is only then that he establishes "roots", of a superficial nature. So, at what stage do we actually "embrace a future", aware that it is a future? I agree with your second sentence, though it is true for a far earlier time, i.e. technically instead of emotionally, from birth... Let's discuss!

I packed on the pounds in college, too, but it was because I stopped working out. Yes, I was eating pizza and french fries every day, but I was doing that in high school, but then spending two hours in the gym four or five times a week. I would even stop at McDonald's on the way home from the gym for a milkshake to help me "cool down!" But I maintained my weight because I was young, the metabolism was there, and I was exercising.

College was lazytime. I slept late, laid around, ate whatever I wanted, and guess what? I gained over 40 pounds my first year in college. By the time I graduated, I was over 330 pounds! (Even with seeing a nutritionist and trying LA Weight Loss--which back then meant a lot of supplements which ultimately made me sick and almost put me in the hospital!) It's not like I didn't know what I was doing wrong, I was just choosing to be comfortable, not knowing that emotionally I was breaking into little pieces At the age of perpetrating the offending pattern, we indeed did not necessarily know better and were landed with a fait accompli when we were old/wise enough to understand! that could only be soothed by more eating.

This pouch helped me focus my own history, as I'm sure it's done for you and everyone else who has had the surgery. What I should do is crystal clear--what I will do is still up in the air. I'm still adjusting, I'm still human--albeit I'm a better human now.A good line to be included in the Newbies pack!
I like the phoenix metaphor as well...I was thinking about how I almost burned myself up, and then rose out of the ashes in this new incarnation. I very much believe that I have been reborn and I'm AMAZED at what the human body, the human mind, science and doctors--all of it--can do!

I KNOW you can still be the star--you shine for me already!

-Mike

Thanks again Mike for a wonderfuly reply!
Vim

Vim&Vigour · 03-23-2008, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omaha Jim

Vim my friend.

You and I have had several conversations, and I am one that is often not at a loss for words......

Right now I am.

I need to take this subject in and meditate upon it for awhile. I hope you know how much I appreciate our friendship both here and outside of the forum. Oh yes, Jim, we have found a great friendship - I know it instinctively. From the 5,500 members or so on this Forum, there are a few remarkable, shining souls who make a difference - you being one of them! I am having a lot more "respect" for those who "meet" their future partner through the internet - so easily done and why not just as real? In TTF's instance, it's called a TTF Family! I have often wondered if I use my humor to cover the reality of the drudgery. You have obviously had reason to use humour vs morosity and humour won you the favours you were seeking. I am so glad that you have - you have forged a niche for yourself in the department of being fun and funny. I am sure though that there are times when you might find /have found it difficult to keep up the cheerful, humourous side I am less that 3% away from no longer being morbidly obese, which is an important landmark in your journey and an important cause for celebrationi. We succeed with small increments and we need celebration in our daily lives to succeed and to be spurned onand there is something swelling deep inside me satisfaction? relief? achievement of responsibility?- and I am not quite sure what or how it is going to manifest. readiness to tackle the next step? relief and peacefulness? I many not submit a reply on this for weeks, or it could explode in a day. I just do not know. Rome was not built in one day!

I am going slow on this one.

I echo my buddy Mike, the new Avvie is stunning - you are a beautiful woman. (Don't tell Stephan I said that, aw what the heck, go ahead, I look forward to his response! Stephen chuckled and was tickled pink!)

Thank you for your openness. Life is short - say what you have to say today, because tomorrow may be too late!

Thank you my dear Friend!
Vim

Persephone · 03-23-2008, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vim&Vigour

Persephone, I would love to hear more. I have at long last read your entire thread on "Girl Disappearing" and love your writing. Your insight rings many bells within me and though we do not share the same music or spiritual aspects, so many landmarks are the same! It feels really reassuring and warming to meet another soul of similiar inclination!
Keep up your magnificent writing - most inspiring and refreshing!
Cheers,
Vim

Ah thank you, you sweetheart

I just wanted to point out that those sweet peppermints were a birthday gift to ME. I should have been allowed to dispose/digest of them as I saw fit. It seems that guilt has followed me all my life. Esp mommy guilt. Not a day passes that I don't feel guilty about something.. It eats me alive. I believe I must find the sorce of that and defeat it.

Here's a quote that came directly from the pulpit. A Sr pastor quoting (of all people) Madonna.

"ALL PATHS LEAD TO GOD"

And if I know Madonna that came directly from the Kabbalah.

We are all on the same path, we just have different vision. We all arrive where we are suppose to. No two people will ever see the exact same God.